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Re: What are people buying?

Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2023 9:04 am
by BaronVonWreckedoften
Just bought that, and the first of the six-volume history of the Tank Corps in WW1 (also 50% off). The Duffy is the 2nd Edition, which I believe is vastly improved on the first in terms of the depth and breadth of the information contained therein - so even if you have a 1st Edition (valuable in its own right), I would say that the newer version is worth a punt!

Other purchases include 8 Ospreys about aspects of WW1, from various series. A Men-At-Arms on the Canadian Corps, two Elites on Trench Warfare, and several of the Great War titles from the Combat series. Hitherto, I have been rather sceptical about this series, as many of the titles, particularly those from the days before the soldier's individuality or training was sufficiently different from his opponent's to have much impact on the battlefield, seemed somewhat - often very - contrived. However, the first two received - British Soldier v German Soldier (the Somme 1916 - but NOT Day 1), and British Cavalryman v German Cavalryman (Belgium 1914) - have well and truly broken that mold. The latter tome particularly is a mine of information, not just on the hard-to-find (relative to the infantry and artillery) information on cavalry tactics, organisation and weaponry, but also the different recruitment and training systems (professionals v conscripts) and a lot of detail on "horsemastership" - eg everyone but the Italians apparently leant back in the saddle when jumping an obstacle or riding downhill, whereas today, everyone uses the Italian system and leans forward; similarly, only the British of the three main combatants on the Western Front, appear to have routinely dismounted when halted, or frequently got off and walked during long periods of marching in order to reduce strain on the horse.

And finally, some interesting - and unusual - titles from Naval & Military Books (also having a sale - only 20% in their case, but as Tesco says, every little helps!). This includes two books on WW1 French training and organisation, and tactics for trench warfare; ditto for the British, plus two sets of "notes for officers" on deployment and tactics for the Lewis Gun and the VIckers. Sadly, similar books on the Germans seem not to be as widely available (in part, I believe, due to the massive loss of records in the bombing of Potsdam in 1944).

Now all I need to do is build a bloody big extension/library to house all this stuff. The double-floor one (or the Irish through-lounge as my father used to call it) in Professor Higgins' house - sorry, Professah 'Iggins 'Aaaase - would do nicely....

Re: What are people buying?

Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2023 10:56 am
by FreddBloggs
Just had a 'discussion' with someone presenting themselves as a historian about Plumers attack on Messines Ridge being a bloody shambles which was why Gough was brought in to rectify the situation..... (their view, not mine.)

Also learnt something interesting, the lowest passing out grades pre ww1 at Sandhurst went to the cavalry, as the Infantry etc all had higher requirements. It is why Churchill was commissioned into a cavalry regiment....

The NMP sale was lethal to me.

Re: What are people buying?

Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2023 12:18 pm
by BaronVonWreckedoften
Interestingly, you had to pass out in the top 10% to get offered a post in the Indian Army.

Didn't either the Australians or the Canadians refuse to serve under Gough and ask to be transferred to Plumer's command, late on in the war?

Re: What are people buying?

Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2023 2:55 pm
by DougM
FreddBloggs wrote: Thu Aug 24, 2023 10:56 am Just had a 'discussion' with someone presenting themselves as a historian about Plumers attack on Messines Ridge being a bloody shambles which was why Gough was brought in to rectify the situation..... (their view, not mine.)

Also learnt something interesting, the lowest passing out grades pre ww1 at Sandhurst went to the cavalry, as the Infantry etc all had higher requirements. It is why Churchill was commissioned into a cavalry regiment....

The NMP sale was lethal to me.
I daren't look....

Re: What are people buying?

Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2023 3:24 pm
by FreddBloggs
BaronVonWreckedoften wrote: Thu Aug 24, 2023 12:18 pm Interestingly, you had to pass out in the top 10% to get offered a post in the Indian Army.

Didn't either the Australians or the Canadians refuse to serve under Gough and ask to be transferred to Plumer's command, late on in the war?
Whole brigades did it in early 18 British troops too, it was why Plumer was recalled from Italy. Monash said it on record.

Re: What are people buying?

Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2023 5:17 pm
by BaronVonWreckedoften
I thought it was either Monash or Currie who had said it "out loud"; odd, though, that the rejection was at brigade level, rather than division or corps. Probably the only sound "military" decision Lloyd George made in the entire war was sacking Gough - though ironically, it was more to spite Haig and leave him isolated, ready to be sacked, as DLG thought Gough was the only real friend Haig had in France.

Re: What are people buying?

Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2023 5:21 pm
by BaronVonWreckedoften
FreddBloggs wrote: Thu Aug 24, 2023 10:56 am Also learnt something interesting, the lowest passing out grades pre ww1 at Sandhurst went to the cavalry, as the Infantry etc all had higher requirements. It is why Churchill was commissioned into a cavalry regiment....
If it actually was a thing (as opposed to jealousy - possibly socio-economically based due to the greater financial backing required for cavalry service) I suspect that that changed substantially post-Boer War, as the subsequent approach was for cavlary officers to learn how to fight an infantry battle as well as a cavalry one, whereas infantry only had to learn to fight in one format. I suggest you read the Osprey Combat book I referred to earlier - your theory doesn't sit well with the impressive performance of all but one of the regimental officers involved in the three actions studied.

Re: What are people buying?

Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2023 9:08 pm
by FreddBloggs
There was a distinct difference between pre boer war and post boer war cavalry officers, look at the number of younger cavalry men involved in the nascent tank corps and RFC.

I suspect divisional and corps commanders had more to lose than brigadiers.

It was rumoured (2nd hand reports) that the reason DLG didn't sack Haig, as it would have made certain Foch as overall commander, where Haig was also a candidate.

DLGs other problem was that Haig had the dirt on him, the missing 100,000 troops in march 1918....

Re: What are people buying?

Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2023 9:09 pm
by Peeler
EB, " ... lack of suitable response ... I'm hiding away in a Shepherds hut in the Peak District ... I'm struggling to keep up with the real world."

None of that comes as a surprise.

Re: What are people buying?

Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2023 10:23 pm
by Count Belisarius
Probably quite familiar as well...